arctic circle & tropic of cancer
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From: Cybeteria Guest
hey and hmm.
bohemia, bo he mi a.the train zoomed us out last sunday,
with our feet and maps. We stepped out into village of
stone brick clay, still ice and winter clung to the
streets. soon out of towns and in the valley, walking,
and the cracking creek there showed us who the poet is.
i don't mind, i'd rather walk than speak. resting under
thin dark trees, put my palms to the chilled ground,
my body losing borders, touching all the way to home.
SEE YA AROUND, NORAH
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From: artcompas@euronet.nl
Date: Sat, 23 Mar 96 08:48:45
Why don"t you know how you got into 'this thing'?
I would't mind telling something about myself, however...
who are you? and why are you interested in me? Please
introduce yourself first.
Francis
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From: schnars@ais.org
Date: Sat, 23 Mar 96 11:25:06
Francis,
I am not the person whom you were responding to,
but am taking up your challenge to exchange an
introduction for an introduction in this otherwise
very dead list.
I graduated from the University of Michigan - Flint
last summer with a Bachelors Degree in Applied Science,
for which I combined classwork in studio art and computer
science. Since then, I have been mainly occupied with
commissioned artwork -- portraits and such. My most recent
commission is making the art for a children's coloring book
for a local story teller, featuring a character which she
created.
My husband is a programmer and aviation historian, and our
various interests (including our love of road trips) lead
us to travel around the U.S. as much as possible.
Your turn. :) Kathryn
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From: bradshaw@yknet.yk.ca
Date: Sat, 23 Mar 96 12:45:53
Hello all
I might as well jump in too.
I teach heavy equipment mechanics at a community college
in Canada's Yukon. I corresponded with Phillip Pocock
when he was looking for Internet contacts in the north,
and thus got involved with this list.
I have been hanging on to see what happens next. I'm
sure someone could write a book about how not to run a
mail group and pull most of his/her examples from here.
There appears to be no one at the controls, and litle
interest in making it friendly.
I expect it will die eventually from the effects of not
belonging to anyone, but it the meantime it provides a
few chuckles from time to time.
I'd be interested to hear - in the list - from anyone who
got anything out of their subscription.
Gord
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From: pocock@dom.de
Date: Sun, 31 Mar 96 08:54:18
> Gord said:
> I'd be interested to hear - in the list - from anyone
> who got anything out of their subscription.
>
> Kathryn said:
> During Philip and Felix's trip to the Arctic Circle
> last August, I got some truly pictorial descriptions of
> the land surrounding them as they traveled, and some
> anecdotes as well. This time around though, on the Tropic
> of Cancer Tour, very little has been said. One wonders if
> this is due to impossible Internet connections, or an
> inability to make sense of perhaps a more canned or pre-
> packaged type of a trip, or something else (maybe they
> miss Philip's input). Felix and Florian never said!
> I did get some very nice U.S. travel tips, though,
> from someone whom I helped unsubscribe from this list.
Philip writes:
Flattering remarks aside, Kathryn, you have demonstrated
the transparency that this form of communcication offers.
Graphic displays are interchangeable, email, or text-based
communication always lurks on the bottom line.
What you have observed is in my view accurate. Perhaps I
might put it as follows: arctic circle is Internet-Art,
that is art formed by the medium; whereas tropic of
cancer is Art-on-the-Net, that is art that would happen
independent of the specific medium chosen, i.e. photocopies,
silkscreen, video would get the identical message across.
The net as a form, in my view, should inform the content
(us). We are the content! This ignored, art will, of course,
still occur, but alongside it comes miscommunication as happened
between Cologne and Mexico and New York and everywhere. This is
what you intuited!
The form of a net is more holes than anything else, so it
is very easy to fall into one and screw things up for a time.
This we learned.
cu, philip
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From: danilowitz@aol.com
Date: Tue, 02 Apr 96 19:25:14
Finally I'm replying. Thanks for the info. I didn't get
much from the arctic circle thing and since I'm a real
novice I don't really know what I expected to get out of
it. But is nice to know you. I am an art historian and
curator at the Josef and Anni Albers Foundation. I was
born in South Africa and lived there most of my life.
Came to the USA 10 years ago with my husband (an attorney)
and 2 sons (both now in college - one at U of Michigan in
Ann Arbor. Is Flint asnywhere near Ann Arbor. We come out
there from Connecticut at least once a year. Your work
sound interesting. i love to travel but there are major
parts of the USA that I haven't seen. Everything westy of
Chicago! If you want to know about travel in southern Africa
let me know.
I heard from you via a New York Kunsthalle mailing,
and I signed on out of curiosity, but I'm still not sure
what it is I've signed on to being a novice in cyberspace.
i'm and art historian, writer on art and curator, but this
cyberspace art has me flummoxed. Is this a chat line or
what? if you can enlighten me I'll be happy.
Have I fallen through the holes? Help???
Brenda Danilowitz
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From: bradshaw@yknet.yk.ca
Date: Tue, 02 Apr 96 23:48:56
> At 17:34 02/04/96 -0500, Brenda Danilowitz
> wrote:
> HHeavy mechanics sounds, weel, heavy.
Well, it's a living. I'm really best at reading old science
fiction, but it doesn't pay very well.
> And the Yukon. how cold is it up there?
Funny you should ask - we set a record this morning:
-29 C (or -20 F... which scale did you use in South Africa?)
> Brenda wrote:
> I'm an art historian, curator, write, formerly from South
> Africa, exploring cyberspace but know nothing about it.
This probably has not been the best introduction. There's lots to
see, but the nature of your connection to the Internet is important
because it will determine which Internet resources will be more valuable
to you. If you have a text-based connection - that is, words only - there
are email groups like Arctic Circle but focused more on art, history, art
history, and so forth. There are probably Usenet news groups that serve
these areas as well. If you have a graphical connection - the kind that
displays pictures and allows you to navigate with a mouse - there are
more sites that you can visit, primarily on the World Wide Web.
What do you use?
Gord
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From: schnars@ais.org
To: Felix Huber, 102221.2120
Date: Sat, Apr 13, 1996, 7:49 PM
RE: YET ANOTHER REPLY TO PHILIP...
Hi Philip and other folks on the arctic list!
I am slow in doing this, but I wanted to respond to Philip's last
post, in which he said:
> Flattering remarks aside, Kathryn, you have demonstrated the
> transparency that this form of communcication offers. Graphic
> displays, email are interchangeable, with email, or text-based
> communication always lurking on the bottom line.
> What you have observed is in my view accurate. Perhaps i might
> put it as follows: arctic circle is Internet-Art, that is art
> formed by the medium; whereas tropic of cancer is Art-on-
> the-Net, that is art that would happen independent of specific
> medium chose, i.e. photocopies, silkscreen, video would get the
> identical message across.
Agreed, the tropic of cancer could have been shown anywhere,
it was mainly just pictures -- nothing unique -- people might just
as well have looked at a book, gallery, or grafitti on a wall. On
the other hand, arctic circle came much closer to utilizing the most
distinctive aspect of Internet: the real-time-interaction between all
involved, which, as you pointed out, was the Art Product.
Now I wonder, where do you go from here? Evolution of this
medium will occur, but in what direction? Perhaps that path would
lead to posting during an event, or several events simultaneously
from remote sites. The events could be related, or stark contrasts
to each other (imagine the textural difference between posting
from the Arctic Circle at the same time as the Tropic of Cancer).
Or, taking a different path, you could capitalize on the r-t-i
aspect and have, metaphorically speaking, the "What Is My Big Toe
Doing Now?" Show -- a common frame of reference from which
anyone could interact. Anyway, in my admittedly hedonistic
opinion, you should experiment now and ask if it is art later!
Go-go-go!
-- Kathryn
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From: felix.huber@thing.nyc.ny.us
Date: Sun, Apr 14, 1996, 2:30 PM
RE: reply to Kathryn
hi Kathryn,
It's quite a while since my last time in the forum, but I moved
to Cologne (Germany) from New York and I had to deal with more
material problems then our virtual travel. Anyway, your question
is one, that I had in my head during the whole travel project.
> Now I wonder, where do you go from here? Evolution of this
> medium will occur, but in what direction?
What you have on the www is mainly not even as fast as fax
communication. It is still closer to television than communication
in two ways. In both projects was the main problem to produce for
an audience, instead of traveling together virtually. It took
always more then a week to put our experience on the net and get
some response. That's almost like mail art.
> Agreed, the tropic of cancer could have been shown anywhere,
> it was mainly just pictures -- nothing unique -- people might
> just as well have looked at a book, gallery, or grafitti on a wall.
> On the other hand, arctic circle came _much_ closer to utilizing
> the most distinctive aspect of Internet: the real-time-interaction
> between all involved, which as you pointed out was the Art Product.
That is not the point, both projects, arctic circle and tropic of
cancer, could be shown anywhere, both are made in a way like a book,
except, of the inputs from "readers" like you. Only, arctic
circle has more personal input, more inhalt, more passion than tropic
of cancer which is more related to the art world, to reflection about
tourism us. Even if you say, "the medium is the message" as McLuhan
said, you still have different messages and for that different
audiences. And tropic of cancer was more art (history) oriented.
The crazy thing about the net is, that people get addicted about
'real' things, to get as close as possible to live, but from the
anonymity behind the screen. To get 'real' live you could just go
around the corner to a bar and hear some strange storys or get in-
volved with strangers.
> Or, taking a different path, you could capitalize on the r-t-i
> aspect and have, metaphorically speaking, the "What Is My Big Toe
> Doing Now?" Show -- a common frame of reference from which anyone
> could interact.
Art or not, the possibility to interact in a more exciting way, is
coming in the next years, technically, on the net. Games, that is
the thing, art games, love games, adventure games, all interaction
on a virtual playground. When Norah (the transient girl from arctic
circle) wrote us, when she saw our web site from an internetcafe in,
I don't know where,
"Maybe the movie is over, but I'm still here.
I am not a video game.
I am not a comfortable memory.
I am real."
This is a cry for real live, even, when it was great playing a
figure in play on the web. And how do you know that email was real?
Maybe it was just an other dramatic turn in our virtual game and
Norah is only living in my head. And arctic circle never happened,
except on Philip's and my computer. Fiction, is the opposite of the
net. When photography was the medium for the memory of real life,
is the net the medium for real life, real time, what ever that means.
But like CNN, when you intend to show 'reality' instantly,
reality itself becomes fiction. On our trip on the arctic circle we
were not really there, we were in a movie, everything we did or
looked at, was for the net, our being there was dominated by the
audience, we experienced, what would be worth to see and hear.
felix
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From: Florian Wuest, 101661.1431
To: arctic@thing.nyc.ny.us
Date: Sun, Apr 21, 1996
hi Kathryn,
just want to add few things to Felix's mail. Internet-Art or Art-on-the
-net, I barely figure out the difference.Basically it is the question if
one is interested in the information that is set up or not, whether one
likes the product or not.
you wrote:
> During Philip and Felix's trip to the Arctic Circle last August, I
> got some truly pictorial descriptions of the land surrounding
> them as they traveled, and some anecdotes as well. This time
> around though, on the Tropic of Cancer Tour, very little has
> been said. One wonders if this is due to impossible Internet con-
> nections, or an inability to make sense of perhaps a more canned
> or pre-packaged type of a trip, or something else (maybe they
> miss Philip's input). Felix and Florian never said!
In fact, it was our decision to deny pictorial descriptions. We prefered to
compress some situations we encountered, and not to overload anybody with
our impressions and emotions on tour. Decided to rely on significant pictures
more than on text.
Basically we wanted modest, unpretentious picts of our traveler-being in Mexico.
Not even would say tropic of cancer was art oriented (like Felix did).
Florian
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From: Christoph Keller
To: arctic@thing.nyc.ny.us
Date: Fri, Apr 26, 1996
Hi all,
We've opened a new TC-site at Internationale Stadt/International City
Federation in Berlin. The URL is http://www.icf.de/tcancer/. Tropic of
Cancer is presented 'solito' there, but the Arctic Circle is linked as
well as a number of other interesting www-travelogue-projects.
This is Christoph finally entering the mail forum, after a series of
unbelievable bad-weather-email, that held me from wanting to discuss
anything around AC/TC. But like in real life, you wait for a while and
the weather clears up again.
Arctic Circle and Tropic of Cancer are two approaches to travelogue on
the web. They have their differences and their similarities, that makes
them interesting to compare. I don't want to fall into the holes of
dualism right from the start. In order to give some background-inform-
ation about the project I was part of, with this email comes the text on
TC that Felix, Florian and I wrote for a presentation of the two projects
in the Kunsthalle NY shortly after the trip.
Best, christoph
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copyright 1996 felix s. huber, christoph keller, philip pocock, florian wüst